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davebirch
Senior Member
Here's yet another thought, from a broadcaster, on the issue:
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-03-26/steve-smith-and-australia-ball-tampering-scandal/9586454
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-03-26/steve-smith-and-australia-ball-tampering-scandal/9586454
I bet they don't now!
We used that (insulation) tape to hold our football socks up and pads in place too. However they do it in all sorts of colours other than the High Vis variety that Bancroft rather unwisely chose.* I guess his brains are in his arms and not between his ears .
btw * Just seen the interview and it is apparently supplied in the kit bags! I know it's prob for taping body protection in place or similar but it's still funny isn't it? As for that interview I don't believe at the time that Smith realised the severity which the cricketing world would view this incident. All that 'we'll move on and be stronger for it' bull. Tell that to the press and media Steve and when you have finished do the same with the the sponsors etc. I think he'll have plenty of time for proper reflection in the future.
Wilpshire Blue
Senior Member
Dave, strangely enough, this could eventually spin round to put Australian cricket in a good light.
If CA were to take decisive and strong action, regardless of the personnel involved, then perhaps the history books may look back and say, "Australia was so outraged at this premeditated cheating that they instigated complete bans for all involved and set the standards which other nations must follow".
It's in their (your) hands.
OnlyOneTugay
Prediction Champion 2019 & 2020
Please keep posting the links and reports Dave , a great insight into how this is viewed down under
Three points :
1) the ' tape ' doesn't look like tape to me on the video , it looks like a small piece of card ( like sandpaper ?) I had insulation tape in my kit bag when I played cricket to wrap around damaged /cracked bits of the bat . Yes ,exactly like the stuff to tie up your socks and hold you shin pads in place for football , but it's flexible . What's happened to the offending 'tape' that looked like card ?
2) Simon Hughes ( cricketing analyst ) tested the likely effect of sandpaper on one side of a new ball in a wind tunnel at Bath University . Rubbed the sandpaper on one side for 30 seconds and at high speed ( 85mph) it immediately reverse swung - prodigiously in his words . Again ( sorry Dave this isn't sour grapes ) I'm questioning what went on in the Ashes , when the Aussies got reverse swing in the most benign conditions and England didn't . The Kookaburra ( used in the recent Ashes and these Tests ) has a flat seam and unpolishable leather and goes softer much more quickly than the Duke , which has a prominent seam and polishable leather . Perhaps time to use the English made Duke in all test cricket, so that players don't have to 'cheat/tamper' in their attempts to even out the balance between bat and ball
2) As Gordon said Smith's 'we'll move on and be stronger for it' is complacent arrogance of the highest degree . We've cheated , you've found us out , but honestly we'll be better people from hereonin - complete and utter bull . I'd increase any ban by another month just for that garbage alone .
Three points :
1) the ' tape ' doesn't look like tape to me on the video , it looks like a small piece of card ( like sandpaper ?) I had insulation tape in my kit bag when I played cricket to wrap around damaged /cracked bits of the bat . Yes ,exactly like the stuff to tie up your socks and hold you shin pads in place for football , but it's flexible . What's happened to the offending 'tape' that looked like card ?
2) Simon Hughes ( cricketing analyst ) tested the likely effect of sandpaper on one side of a new ball in a wind tunnel at Bath University . Rubbed the sandpaper on one side for 30 seconds and at high speed ( 85mph) it immediately reverse swung - prodigiously in his words . Again ( sorry Dave this isn't sour grapes ) I'm questioning what went on in the Ashes , when the Aussies got reverse swing in the most benign conditions and England didn't . The Kookaburra ( used in the recent Ashes and these Tests ) has a flat seam and unpolishable leather and goes softer much more quickly than the Duke , which has a prominent seam and polishable leather . Perhaps time to use the English made Duke in all test cricket, so that players don't have to 'cheat/tamper' in their attempts to even out the balance between bat and ball
2) As Gordon said Smith's 'we'll move on and be stronger for it' is complacent arrogance of the highest degree . We've cheated , you've found us out , but honestly we'll be better people from hereonin - complete and utter bull . I'd increase any ban by another month just for that garbage alone .
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OnlyOneTugay
Prediction Champion 2019 & 2020
Just seen a picture of a South African youngster asking Nathan Lyon to autograph the back of some sandpaper
A
ABBEY
Guest
thing is tho cheating aint funny.
Wilpshire Blue
Senior Member
Michael Vaughan with a few points.
As he says, ban them for as long as you like but when they come back, they will always be remembered as the cheats.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/43546222
As he says, ban them for as long as you like but when they come back, they will always be remembered as the cheats.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/43546222
No but humiliation of a once proud man is an important part of the punishment. Especially when it's from your peers and your previous supporters. Being humiliated in front of your class mates at school was much worse than the corporal alternatives imo.
Can almost hear the beer fuelled barmy army now................... Oh cheaty cheaty.... cheaty cheaty cheaty Australia. I doubt the sledging and barracking that Lehman was complaining about from the SA crowd will come close to what's in store for them around the world from now on.
davebirch
Senior Member
Vaughan doesn't seem to remember Atherton's misdemeanor, does he?, or Trescothick and his sweets falling out of his pocket in front of the Umpire, ones he used to "shine" one side of the ball.
Did we ever consider Atherton as a cheat? Because if you are calling Bancroft a cheat, then it stands that Atherton was too.
Indeed, Drog. It's meant as a dig at Smith for his indiscretions. I'll bet he and his team mates don't come back to Aus directly, because if they do they will be put under some microscopic examination by the local press.
Ball tampering has been going on for as long as.....
It's only a problem when you get caught.
Wilpshire Blue
Senior Member
I guess the question is whether Atherton was acting on an impulse that came to him whilst out on the field.
If he had a meeting with his fellow players in the changing room and it was agreed that he should deliberately take some dirt out in his pocket and tamper with the ball, then I'd consider it the same.
That seems to be the main difference here Dave - premeditated cheating.
Take the famous instances in this article - each of them could have been spur-of-the-moment actions by the player in isolation during play, no proof otherwise.
The current Aussie example, however, is a different level of cheating.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/43532624
have to chuckle about Warner's comments on Du Plessis in the final example
OnlyOneTugay
Prediction Champion 2019 & 2020
This goes beyond simple ball tampering . I think Atherton ( despite his previous indiscretion ) hit the nail on the head . It's become a combination of things . There's the ball tampering and the embarrassing attempts to cover it up by Bancroft on field . Then there was the admission it was planned and premeditated by the experienced leadership group using a young rookie as the fall guy . Finally the all round hubris and hypocrisy of this Australian outfit that's totally trashed the spirit of the game since the Lehman/Smith/Warner era started . The fact that they're successful but intensely disliked by the Australian public says it all .
OnlyOneTugay
Prediction Champion 2019 & 2020
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/43543713
Just three involved ? That’s difficult to believe . The bowlers who were using the ball were blissfully unaware ? Also hard to believe Lehman’s fingerprints aren’t all over this as well .
All of a sudden the senior leadership group appears to have been seriously downsized .
Just three involved ? That’s difficult to believe . The bowlers who were using the ball were blissfully unaware ? Also hard to believe Lehman’s fingerprints aren’t all over this as well .
All of a sudden the senior leadership group appears to have been seriously downsized .
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Wilpshire Blue
Senior Member
The tweets from Michael Clarke at the bottom of that article are quite telling.
This will rumble on for some time yet.
yoda
Senior Member
But it’s not only a problem when you get caught is it, it undermines the whole spirit of the game, any one caught should be banned for life
davebirch
Senior Member
An interesting comment from Steve Waugh:
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-03-...ittment-to-spirit-of-cricket-document/9595490
Waugh was the hardest nosed captain I've ever seen, never gave anyone an inch. oh to have him back now.
As an aside, Waugh was a pretty good footballer in his day and could have played professionally.
WB Atherton's must have premeditated as he walked out onto the ground with the soil in his pocket, so he must have known he was going to do something. We'll never know if others were involved.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-03-...ittment-to-spirit-of-cricket-document/9595490
Waugh was the hardest nosed captain I've ever seen, never gave anyone an inch. oh to have him back now.
As an aside, Waugh was a pretty good footballer in his day and could have played professionally.
WB Atherton's must have premeditated as he walked out onto the ground with the soil in his pocket, so he must have known he was going to do something. We'll never know if others were involved.